Christian Taylor shooting

[McNasty 260]

Some black dude got killed by white cops. Here we go again.

I'm not questioning whether or not the kid should have been shot, I'm just curious after watching the video of him jumping on cars and breaking into the place.....does anyone really care? Michael Brown robbed a place right before he got killed. Trayvon tried to thug it up before he got worked. Common theme here......black dudes commiting crimes and then other blacks get pissed the police went too far. Maybe this wouldn't be an issue if you, I dunno, stopped breaking the law in the first place.

I read some article where his brother said he wasn't mad at the 5-0, but that he knew his brother wouldn't attack authority, or anyone for that matter. Lmao.

Just getting tired of this bs. #alllivesmatterstopbeingracistblackpeople

[Commander_Undies 618]

Amen

[TigerBurge 2,375]

People aren't making a big deal of the white kid that just got shot here recently over a bag of weed. Cop shot him twice through his windshield. http://m.wyff4.com/news/public-questioning-the-zachary-hammond-case/34665850

[J4MES OX4D 10,035]

I think the media are milking the non-existent racism element here and the issue should be more in regards to the heavy-handedness of the police. I've read a string of stories of white cops shooting white guys but these don't even make the local news let alone the mainstream and nobody blinks an eye when Joe Bloggs gets popped after acting in a threatening manner towards law authority. However when it's some black guy who's just committed a serious crime and the police are put into a split second decision; when they pull the trigger in that respective incident; it's essentially a 'racist attack'. 

 

A few days ago; Tyrone Harris was shot by cops in Ferguson on the anniversary of Michael Brown killing but the media were more focused on him being shot as opposed to the fact he had a gun and was attempting to murder police officers. Perhaps these hotshot criminals who think they're gangsters and badassess shouldn't put themselves into such dangerous situations where police may be enticed to use excessive force. The media are fueling the wrong fire and really driving a wedge in society and between the law that's just going to make situations like these more prominent. 

[The3rdWalker 1,271]

It's all a mess guys, even those two brats trying to take over a Bernie Sanders speech. The man walked with MLK!

Let's all just go to the Winchester for a pint until this blows over.

[Docwagon 856]

The media is pushing a narrative.  When cops get killed, the race is NEVER in the headlines.  There is never a "white cop killed by black suspect" or "black cop killed by white suspect'" headline, period.  If there aren't pictures, race is often left to the imagination of the reader.

 

We've had two police action shootings in the past week.  One some a-holes shot up a party and then shot at the responding cops in the stairwell, so the cops shot them back.  The headlines read things like "5 shot in police shooting" making it sound like the cops shot everyone, and later they tried to insinuate the cops were reckless and some people were hit in the crossfire.  You had to dig to figure out that anyone was shot by the suspects before the cops even got there, or that they shot at the cops first.  

 

The second was two black teens did an armed carjacking, the car is used in a driveby shooting, and when cops stop it the driver rams a cop car trying to get out of a dead end, tries to hit cops with his car, and is armed with a handgun.  He gets shot by multiple officers at the same time, falls out the driver's side door and drops the gun.  I can't think of a much more justified shooting.  The narrative now is "where's the video?"  We don't have dashcams, and never have except for a few DUI cars that got them as a grant back in the 90's.  We don't have body cams, and never have except for a brief test program.  You'd think we were hiding the video from the way the media spins the shit, not that there is no video, there never was any video, and there were no cameras to create any video.

 

There are a lot of people pushing anarchy, often by different names, but that's the goal.

[BO7H B4RRELS 2,453]

The media is pushing a narrative.  

 

 

I agree with this 100%.  But, the real question is, "Why?"  Why are they pushing a race narrative, what's their goal?  Keep the public fighting with each other so they're too busy to see all the corruption.  That's my guess.  Tell the masses what they should be upset and passionate about, so that they are too busy to care about all the corruption going on around us involving the government/media/bankers/etc.

[Sennex 1,903]

Its an election year tommy

 

Keep the base divided and focussed on race issues and not the horrible economy, the failing education, the TPP agreement going on in Hawaii 

[BO7H B4RRELS 2,453]

Its an election year tommy

 

Keep the base divided and focussed on race issues and not the horrible economy, the failing education, the TPP agreement going on in Hawaii 

 

Yeah, I'm sure the election plays a huge role in this.  Good point.  

[Drifter 851]

The media pumps up the race card all the time no matter if it's election year or what year it is. They've been doing it for years and it gets worse and worse every passing year. To them they  feel it makes good reporting. If you have a headline that says "White cops kill black man" it grabs more attention than the truth "Drug dealer attacks cops and gets shot because of his actions".

 

IMO media outlets should be legally held accountable for inciting violence because they are the ones that pump all this race bullshit out there that gets all the sheep following right along in line with what they want them to think.

[Docwagon 856]

I agree with this 100%.  But, the real question is, "Why?"  Why are they pushing a race narrative, what's their goal?  Keep the public fighting with each other so they're too busy to see all the corruption.  That's my guess.  Tell the masses what they should be upset and passionate about, so that they are too busy to care about all the corruption going on around us involving the government/media/bankers/etc.

 

Maybe.  At the simplest level, controversy sells and therefore makes more money.

 

If I write a book about Lincoln, no one cares.  If I write a book about Lincoln being gay, I get attention, which results in sales, which results in money.  Who gives a shit if its the truth, right?

[Sennex 1,903]

 

IMO media outlets should be legally held accountable for inciting violence because they are the ones that pump all this race bullshit out there that gets all the sheep following right along in line with what they want them to think.

 

This is a great point, and I have been wondering for a while why more people don't sue for slander or libel.

 

Ferguson MO is a great example

[Docwagon 856]

This is a great point, and I have been wondering for a while why more people don't sue for slander or libel.

 

Ferguson MO is a great example

 

Because the media has lawyers and knows how to skirt it.

 

If there are 50 incidents and I only pick the 5 that "prove" my point, that's perfectly legal.  If I mention race in one incident but not another, that's perfectly legal.  if I use the editorials for one sided opinion pieces, that's legal.

 

There is very little ethics in media these days, and less objectivity.

[Drifter 851]

Because the media has lawyers and knows how to skirt it.

 

If there are 50 incidents and I only pick the 5 that "prove" my point, that's perfectly legal.  If I mention race in one incident but not another, that's perfectly legal.  if I use the editorials for one sided opinion pieces, that's legal.

 

There is very little ethics in media these days, and less objectivity.

 

 

There are instances where it is a bit easier to hold the media a bit more responsible for their action though. Granted I am not naive enough to think there would EVER be a case prosecuted to a conviction when it comes to holding them responsible, because they will hide behind freedom of speech etc etc. One instance that comes to mind is when Michael brown's father was screaming "Burn this bitch down". The media sources ate that up with a spoon and played it over and over for days on end. To me that is something that would have been best to edit out of the broadcast because it did nothing but fuel the fires and incite riots and the burning of the city and cost people their businesses and livelihoods.

 

As I said there is really no way the media would have been able to be prosecuted for continually airing that, but I have seen cities waste money on far less important things so I would have liked to have at least seen some legal action at least threatened against the media if for no other reason than to just send a message.  

[lepercolony 275]

I agree with this 100%.  But, the real question is, "Why?" 

 

clicks = $$$

 

EDIT:  goddammit Doc.  never mind.

 

 

Its an election year tommy

 

Keep the base divided and focussed on race issues and not the horrible economy, the failing education, the TPP agreement going on in Hawaii 

 

you leave Hawaii out of this, you hear me.

 

 

 

the Us vs. Them dynamic in this country right now, with law enforcement in particular, is something i've wanted to try to unpack here for some time, especially with someone like Doc to refer to.  i have police in the family (a few uncles).  i also believe that profiling can lead to unnecessary, sometimes tragic outcomes.  mostly though i think isolated incidents snowball into larger problems, like distrust of police and racial backlash, when people make generalizations about groups like police and minorities and paint them all with the same brush.

 

i think police are held to an unrealistic but necessary standard and should be commended in most cases.  i also think there are people who should not be police.  and i think oversimplifying this issue is a deadly mistake, with a human cost on both "sides."  i wish the mainstream media wouldn't race bait, but i'm frankly more concerned with the radical blogs as those have the potential to inspire some pretty insipid readers to do evil.

[JsinOwl 644]

Nice discussion, saves me the trouble reasoning through it. I love you guys.

[lepercolony 275]

#alllivesmatterstopbeingracistblackpeople

 

officially the most ridiculous thing you've ever written.  and i've read a lot of your posts over the years. 

 

[not saying black folks are precluded from being racist . . . just saying "All Lives Matter" is the most pointless statement you could possibly make.  it's literally meaningless.  unless of course you actually believe that all lives matter equally in the eyes of the law, in every instance, which would be an interesting place to take the discussion.]

[McNasty 260]

Wha wha what?

I've said lots of incendiary things here, and you call this one out?

All lives matter seems to make sense to me. If this was 1964, I'd get the whole blacklivesmatter thing. The problem is that the phrase has been bastardized by its use to bring attention to situations where the black guy was in the wrong. So we're supposed to be on board with blacklivesmatter when the black guy was attacking a cop? Sort of kills the credibility of the point they're trying to make wouldn't you agree?

I don't doubt that there is some prejudice in the system, but to me that seems more a function of experience and real world facts rather than some arbitrary prejudice against black people.

If it's 3am and you're walking the dog, and 3 black dudes are walking past you tell me you wouldn't tense up. That's not a racist statement, it is what it is. I wish that wasn't the case, but you're lying if you say that wouldn't be your reaction. How can we expect the police to act any differently? They're human just like the rest of us. Would you react differently if it were 3 Chinese dudes? I think all of us would. The probability of bad things happening is lower. Should cops ignore that probability for the purpose of being PC? Easy to say, impossible to do. "Awareness" isn't going to change that. They're looking out for #1....themselves.....and rightly so.

I'm rambling at this point, but if you want to play the blacklivesmatter card and not expect people to disagree, find a relevant place for that conversation. Otherwise the alllivesmatter point seems to make a lot of sense as a counter argument.

[lepercolony 275]

bahahahaha it worked.  i'll be honest here . . . i was exaggerating slightly to see if i'd get a response, but i didn't think it'd actually work.  WELCOME BACK POOFY.

 

i think it's a matter of perspective -- i think we can all agree that the #blacklivesmatter hashtag, and the later "organized" movement, arose in direct response to recent national headlines (it's important we agree on that because it's a fact).  so when people -- often people who happen to not be black -- remove this context and read the hashtag literally as if it's a black supremacy statement, they naturally (and incorrectly) feel that this warrants the defensive reaction that has become:  "All Lives Matter." 

 

it's akin to saying, "hey what about turtles tho?" in response to the social outrage that occurs when a dentist shoots a lion with a bow and arrow.

 

so when you say, "what about when black guys are in the wrong," it's kind of a good example of what i'm describing.  that response would only be appropriate if the #blacklivesmatter message was, "Black people do no wrong."  but it's not (as best as i can tell anyway, i'm not sure they have a cohesive mission).

 

here's the thing:  i truly believe "All Lives Matter" is a perfectly natural human reaction that doesn't necessarily come from a malicious place.  but i also think keeping an issue within the appropriate context, and not applying it at a macro level such that the issue loses all significance, is important.  that's all.

 

i'm not defending the movement.  i just think if it's gonna be dismissed, it should be for logical reasons, not emotional ones.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/wp/2015/07/23/nicki-minaj-taylor-swift-alllivesmatter-and-zero-sum-feminism-or-not-everything-is-about-taylor-swift/

 

found this article interesting.  once you get through the opening about Taylor Swift, Nicki Minaj, and Katy Perry, i promise it's relevant.

[McNasty 260]

I think you're being overly cerebral about it (big surprise lol).  I get what you're saying, but if you want an honest perspective on blacklivesmatter - go to their website and decide for yourself.

 

It's a pile of shit.  They're still defending Michael Brown.  Go look at their "demands"  .....

 

lol

[lepercolony 275]

I think you're being overly cerebral about it (big surprise lol).

 

well, it's Friday.  what do you want.  i've had a lot of buildup over the week since my job has been to look at spreadsheets eight hours a day. 

 

this is where my brain comes to splooge.

[Sennex 1,903]

Peggy Hubbard's response to #BlackLivesMatter

 

https://www.facebook.com/peggy.hubbard1/videos/1176909579005002/?pnref=story

 

Worth a watch.

[lepercolony 275]

that's an unfortunate response.  i can see the connection she's trying to make between the two cases, and i 100% believe she means every word she says.  unfortunately, she's conflating separate issues, and what's disappointing is knowing that this will totally enable some folks to dismiss legitimate misconduct against certain minorities by allowing them to say to themselves, "well they're all violent, they do it to themselves . . ."

 

that said, i do think displaying accountability would make BLM's message more accessible to those outside their community (which is where their message needs to be heard).  they have to pick legitimate battles in order to be considered legitimate themselves.

 

can we say black on black crime is a critical issue in some regions?  yes.  can we say there are unjustified police shootings?  yes.  but what you can't say is that the first thing excuses the second thing.  conflating the two, as this woman does here, is lazy and wrong in my opinion.  that's how we're persuaded to stop considering these incidents on a case-by-case basis, as they really should be.  that's what leads us to shrug and roll our eyes instead of thinking critically.  i'm not a cheerleader for BLM or anything, i just think it's sad when their message is misunderstood.  on the other hand, if they don't start picking their battles more critically, their message will remain incoherent.

[lepercolony 275]

following up:  much more constructive criticism for BLM.  from Ben Carson of all people, too.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/politics/ben-carson-blasts-black-lives-matter-for-targeting-127559300721.html

 

"Of course, the protesters are right that racial policing issues exist and some rotten policemen took actions that killed innocent people,” Carson wrote. “But unjust treatment from police did not fill our inner cities with people who face growing hopelessness. Young men and women can’t find jobs. Parents don’t have the skills to compete in a modern job market. Far too many families are torn and tattered by self-inflicted wounds. Violence often walks alongside people who have given up hope.”

 

. . .

 

"I grew up in neighborhoods most Americans were told to never drive through. I saw bullets, drugs and death in the same places I played tag and ball with my friends. Both of my older cousins died on the streets where I lived. I thought that was my destiny. But my mother didn’t. She changed all of that. She saved my brother and me from being killed on those streets with nothing but a library card. My mother knew what the problems were and she shielded me and my brother from them. I can tell you she wasn’t worried about Socialist senators from tiny rural states. “BlackLivesMatter” could learn from her to focus on the real sources of our hopelessness."

[McNasty 260]

And that is why Ben Carson is awesome.