Doc's firearms thread

[Docwagon 856]

LCR review:

 

After much anticipation, I was able to pick up an LCR .357 today. I traded my Taurus 850 CIA hammerless in, primarily because I've gotten so used to the Ruger style cylinder latch that I fumble my reloads with the S&W/Taurus style latch. I wanted to keep everything on the same page. I found the LCR to be a nice upgrade over the Taurus, and worth the $150 difference I paid.

The Taurus I traded:



The LCR comes with a handy zipper pouch with a pocket on the back for speed strips/loaders:



Open it up, and here's the little fellow (already a bit dirty from his first range outing)



I took it to the range and ran an assortment of ammunition through it today, shooting both steels and cardboard. PMC 132 gr 38's were used for my qualification shoot (qualified it as an off duty gun immediately since I traded in the Taurus and didn't have another ankle gun on my qual list)



Now for the meat of the review:

Size/weight: The LCR is 17oz per Ruger, about 6 oz lighter than the Taurus 850 it replaced. Honestly I can't tell much difference in the hand or in an ankle holster. I do see a bit of difference in pocket carry in shorts, but very minimal. The size is almost identical to the eyeball, but there is a small difference once the calipers come out. The Ruger is about 1/4" taller and 1/10th" narrower than the Taurus. Again, no real felt difference in carry although my wife said the Ruger doesn't print in the jeans pocket like the Taurus did. Measurements aside, both are easy guns to carry.

Grip: The LCR has a factory Hogue "Tamer" monogrip. The Taurus has a factory rubber grip. Both feel grippy and give good purchase, but the Ruger fills the palms better and has a channel for speed loaders to clear which the Taurus lacked. The LCR does a MUCH better job of reducing felt recoil. Shooting the LCR with 125 gr .357s is less punishing than shooting .38+Ps through the Taurus. Both were comfortable with standard pressure .38s, but the LCR is a real ***** cat with them. I couldn't believe how light shooting they were. Shooting .38+Ps with the Taurus was a 15 and done event, leaving me with a stinging palm and redness at the base of my thumb. I didn't have any +Ps to run today, but did shoot some Magtech 125gr .357s and felt like I could shoot a full box with no problem. 158grs were beyond the grip's ability to tame, though. I ran one cylinder of Blazer Brass 158gr .357s and had to talk myself into shooting the last one. Its a VERY jumpy gun and is like high fiving a sledge hammer with the full house 158 grains. I didn't have any 110 gr to test.

Cylinder/Ejection: The crane and cylinder release latch are both pretty stiff out of the box, but are loosening up as I work them. The short ejection rod has trouble extracting .357 empties, which is a common failing among revolvers of this size. It ejects .38s very cleanly and reliably though.

Sights: They were surprisingly useful, given the standards in this segment of the gun world. While they are a standard u-notch and front blade, the notch is deeper and better defined than on the Taurus and similar S&Ws. The front blade is black, but is pinned so swapping it out for a high viz should be an easy endeavor. The front sight post is a reasonable width for the intended shooting distances, and lets in a good amount of light on either side for rapid sight alignment. They are definitely geared more toward speed, but taking your time you can get good accuracy as I'll go into in a bit.

Trigger: This is where the LCR really shines. The 850 had a 13 lb trigger. Yeah, I know. My wife couldn't pull it without shaking so hard she couldn't aim it. 9-11 lb seems standard in a DAO revolver but the LCR breaks at....wait for it....wait for it...just under 5 lbs. Ruger says they use a cam system to reduce friction and get a smooth trigger pull. It works. There is absolutely no grit in the trigger, its smooooth. I was stunned at how easy it was to pull, but honestly didn't believe it was that low. The armorer was surprised as well and rechecked it, but the trigger scale kept coming back at between 4.5 and 5 lbs no matter how many times he checked it. It feels slightly heavier than that, I think because of the length of travel, but the scales don't lie.

The trigger has a touch of stack, but very little compared to most any other DA trigger I've shot. Over travel is about 1/8". The trigger breaks cleanly and predictably.  The only complaint I have is with the reset. Unlike most guns were when it clicks its ready to go again the LCR has two clicks. They are ALMOST immediately together, but the ALMOST is what you need to be aware of. While shooting it you probably won't be aware of the clicks, but you MUST let the trigger go all the way forward or you'll have a problem. If you let it click once and then start a new trigger pull, it won't pull and will act like its locked up. Fixing it is as easy as releasing the trigger and starting your pull again. There is a tiny window between the clicks, though, that will let the cylinder turn but not let the hammer fall. In short you'll get a trigger pull but no "bang". I did this with my 2nd cylinder of ammo and kept pulling the trigger on the fired chambers until I got back around to the one that was skipped and set it off. This is easily overcome with practice, but YOU NEED TO PRACTICE TRIGGER RESET if you are going to carry the LCR. I'll take it in exchange for how fantastic the cam system works.

Other than a worked Colt Detective's Special I don't think I've felt a comparable DA trigger in a revolver this size.

Accuracy:



The three shot groups within the bigger circle where my qualification. This was all done with PMC Bronze 132 gr .38s.

As you can see, the 5 shot group in the head at 3 yards is pretty darned tight. The first 2 were almost in the same hole, than 4 in one ragged hole, than the final shot slightly outside of the rest. Calipers say .715" from center to center.

The 5 shot group from 5 yards was almost as tight. Throwing the calipers on it showed the widest spread was 0.8" from center to center.

The 5 shot group from 7 yards opened up more than 2 yards should account for. 4.25" I wasn't real happy so I tried it again and brought it in to 3.5".

From there I stayed at about the same group size. 4.3" at 15 yards and 4.5" at 25 yards, minus one called flier where I was off paper. At 25 yards I was firing as fast as I could find the front sight and on the 3rd shot I knew I had front sight way too far right as I touched it off, so that's definitely on me and not the gun. Still, rapid fire at 25 yards with a sub 2" barrel, I'll take it.

Group size is only part of the story of course. Point of aim vs point of impact is also important. At 7 yards and in they matched up. As I moved further back my point of impact dropped down and to the right. 2.5" at 15 yards and 5.75" at 25 yards. I think this is too much trigger finger on my part. Hand size vs gun size means the trigger is almost to the 2nd joint of my trigger finger holding it naturally. I think as I get more used to the gun and concentrate on not having so much finger inside the trigger housing this will correct itself. At 25 yards bullet weight vs designed bullet may account for some of the drop as well but since I was just holding it center of chest and pulling the trigger I don't have a real accurate measure of bullet drop as there is no precise point of aim to measure from.

I shot steels prior to this target as there was someone using the cardboard target stands. Up to 25 yards and switching between 2 steels I had one miss in 45 shots and I was doing some pretty rapid shooting on 1/2 targets.

Ammo selection:
158 gr .357s are a bad idea. The recoil is approaching painful and the jump is too much to accept in a defensive pistol. Follow up shots are simply too slow as you recover, and the recoil is so heavy it encourages flinching.
125 gr .357s are a less bad idea. Recoil is reasonable, and follow up shots are quicker.
110 gr .357s...I dunno. I didn't have any to test. "They" say that they can jump crimp in such a lightweight rapid recoiling hand gun. I don't know, but I've never used 110 gr anyway.

158 gr .38+P is reasonable. Recoil is moderate, slightly less than the 125 gr .357s
130 gr .38+P is probably going to be my choice (Wichester PDX-1 bonded) as the recoil is very reasonable and the balance of recoil/terminal ballistic performance is a win in my book.

**.38s have the edge for another reason as well, empty case extraction. The short ejection rod has trouble getting hot .357 rounds out as they conform to the walls more due to pressure (sticking in the chamber harder) and longer length so they have to move further before they fall free. Even a good whack occasionally leaves a "hanger" on one or two chambers, slowing your reload. .38s ejected much more cleanly, several empties fell out once the revolver was flipped upside down even before the smack on the ejection rod.**

Overall thoughts:

The LCR is the little engine that could. It carries like the small gun it is, but shoots like a much larger gun in terms of recoil and control for quick followup shots. The U-notch sights are much better than the usual groove sights and helps somewhat overcome the short sight radius. The trigger is awesome, and if the reset didn't have that little glitch would be the perfect DAO trigger. The shape, size, and weight are perfect for concealed carry in any of its usual iterations (belt, ankle, pocket) and draws should be snag-free.

Why the .357 over the .38? The .38 LCR is a bit lighter, but otherwise dimensionally the same. Its also cheaper. .357s can be a real hand full in a lightweight gun like this and most (if not all) folks are better off running .38s though it. So, again, why the .357? For me it was because my primary EDC is a GP100 and this way my speed strip will feed either the primary or the BUG. Additionally, I reload, and this gives me a bit more flexibility in OAL and the like on my loads. I don't know if the bit of extra weight helps with recoil any appreciable amount or not, but if it does that's also in favor of the .357. While the added flexibility of being able to run .357s is nice, I think its primarily a .38 with the option of taking the occasional .357 if the situation dictates.

I shoot it better than I ever did the Taurus, I think primarily because of the better sights and better trigger than any real mechanical difference in potential accuracy. Its also much more comfortable to shoot. I'd glad I made the switch.

 

***CORRECTION***

 

Since I wrote the original review I've had a chance to use a more accurate trigger scale with the gun locked in a vise.  The trigger breaks at about 7.75 lbs, which is more believable compared to the feel, and is outstanding for a double action trigger pull.

[JsinOwl 644]

Wow, thanks Jsin, I appreciate you swapping everything over!

No problem, I'll keep pecking away at it, too much good stuff to lose.

[JsinOwl 644]

Here's a common question I see, and one with a lot of misinformation out there.  Is the .22 LR suitable for self-defense?

 

Short answer:  No.

 

Long answer: No.  Here's why.

 

The first priority in a self defense weapon of any type is reliability.  Rimfire cartridges do not fire as reliably as center fire, period.  This is independent of if a particular firearm is reliable or cycles with the ammo, the way that rim fire rounds are primed allows for an uneven distribution of the priming compound, which means that sometimes there is a dead spot on the rim that even if hit by the strongest of firing pins WILL NOT FIRE THE ROUND.  The round may very well fire the 2nd time its hit in a different location, and that's fine for target practice and training, or even small game hunting, but it may get you killed in a fire fight.

 

The .22 is also simply not effective, especially from a handgun.  While you at least get respectable velocity out of a rifle barrel, out of a handgun you have the worst of both worlds, low velocity and low bullet weight.  I've had people hit with a .22 think it was a bb gun and not go to the hospital for hours.  I know of at least one victim who has one lodged in his lung, no surgery required, basically a bandaid and some rubbing alcohol was all he needed at the ER.  Myths of the .22 tumbling wildly in the body are untrue.  Statistics that show more people are killed by a .22 than any other caliber are not properly weighted by number of shootings.  .22 is cheap, ubiquitous, and a great hobby round but should not be considered for self defense if you have any other option.

[JsinOwl 644]

I'm considering my next purchase.  My friends laugh at me that I do 3 months of research and then have 5 distributors submit competitive bids before I buy anything, and they aren't far off.  In this case, I really only have my eyes on 3 options, all of which are ankle guns.

 

1) Springfield XDS.  This is the least likely option.  Its big for an ankle gun, and I'm not convinced on the ballistics of a .45 out of a short barrel.

2) Ruger LCR in .357.  This is the most likely option, it would be a great backup to my Ruger GP100.

3) Smith & Wesson Shield in .40S&W.  A viable option.  .40 works well in a shorter barrel, and the sights are good.

 

The XDS has really nice sights from the factory and everyone who shoots them says they have surprisingly little felt recoil.  Like I said above, I think its just a bit chunky for my intended use, though.  I'm also of the mind that the .45 suffers from a short barrel, not gaining enough velocity to reliably expand.

 

The LCR is lightweight, and shoots .38 or .357.  I'd likely keep it loaded with Gold Dot .38+P, but when carrying the larger Ruger my speed strip would feed either revolver.  The sights suck, though, as they typically do on snubby revolvers, but the LCR's front sight is pinned and swapping out for a better one isn't a major operation.  There are plenty of options for ammunition for short barreled .357 or .38 ammo, in weights from 125 to 158 grain, many with low flash powder.  Its tough to argue with .38+P in a short barrel for available options.

 

The Shield has good sights, but the stock trigger is full of suck and terrible.  Apex makes a drop in kit, though, that makes it pretty nice.  The .40 is a high pressure round and makes good velocity out of the shorter barrel, ballistic wise I'm happy with it. Cost-wise, the Shield with an Apex will be about $100 cheaper than the LCR and a replacement front sight.

 

Decisions, decisions.  Screw it, maybe I'll buy a cowboy .30-30 lever action.

[JsinOwl 644]

A holster review/comparison I did for another site:

 

This is reference the Crossbreed Super Tuck for the Sig P220, ordered without the Combat Cut.

 

 

 

I had very high hopes going into this.  People tend to talk about the Crossbreed in very superlative terms, "the most comfortable" and "most concealable" come up frequently.  I waited the 9 weeks it took for it to be made and delivered because of those reviews.  Its a fine holster, don't get me wrong, and I'll continue to use it but if I had it to do over again I would have stuck with High Noon Holsters, as I will explain.

 

I will be comparing the Super Tuck to two High Noon offerings.

 

For comparison purposes, I have also carried a Glock 22 in a Split Decision and a gov't sized 1911 in a Tailgunner, both IWB offerings from High Noon Holsters.  The Split Decision is tuckable.  While the pistols are not the exact same dimensions, I believe they are close enough to warrant comparison.  I will not be including the Galco Summer Comfort, as its for a 3" barrel GP100 and wouldn't be close enough to draw reasonable conclusions, but I will eventually get around to a separate review for it.

 

COMFORT

 

The Super Tuck is comfortable after the break in period molds the leather to your body and softens the backing a bit.  I also needed to adjust the cant and ride depth.  When both hooks were in the next to the bottom holes, the front of the leather would dig into the top of my leg when I sat.  This was more of an issue in some of my jeans than in dress pants, where the belt line is a bit lower.  I ended up putting the front hook in the bottom hole, getting less cant and a higher ride up front and its comfortable now.

 

I find the Super Tuck is slightly more comfortable with a full sized pistol, as the leather backing spreads the pressure from the slide against more of your flesh compared to the two traditional shaped holsters.  If you don't wear an undershirt, the Split Decision lacks a flap to keep the slide off your skin, which isn't as comfortable.

 

1st place: Super Tuck (after break in)

2nd place: Tailgunner

3rd place: Split Decision

 

Ease of Draw

 

As shipped without the Combat Cut, it sucks.  Drawing is a two stroke process, as you can't wrap your fingers around the grip.  Your fingernails will impact the leather back first, so you must pull your pistol up, then assume grip, then finish your draw.  That is unacceptable to me, as I don't want to bobble around with a gun under an adrenaline dump.  Certain deep concealment holsters may mandate a two step draw, but for a holster with this much bulk it shouldn't be considered.  Either order the Combat Cut, cut it yourself, or steer clear.

 

This is the back of the holster and shows how much I trimmed off.  Note the extra little scallop at the bottom to help my fingers clear the leather.  This isn't as dramatic as the factory Combat Cut, and I really like the level of comfort vs grip.

 

 

The high noon offerings both allow a full grip immediately without any modification.

 

All offerings allow for a smooth draw stroke once broken in properly.  The Kydex breaks more audibly and requires heating to be adjusted. The leather holsters just give you the gun smoothly and can be adjusted by a tension screw with no muss or fuss.

 

Part of "ease of draw" is also stability.  You want the gun where you put it, same place all the time.  You don't want the cant rocked too far forward or too far back, etc.  The Split Decision will move if you don't use a quality belt.  The Tailgunner will really resist rocking or moving with even a half decent belt.  The Crossbreed sticks, period.  The two clips are more stable by design.  This is really the biggest advantage the Crossbreed offers, rock solid stability.

 

1st place (tie) Modified Super Tuck or Tailgunner

2nd place: Split Decision

3rd place: Unmodified/cut Super Tuck

 

Concealability

 

The Crossbreed is slightly less thick, since the clips are off to the sides instead of stacking thickness with the body of the weapon.  The Split Decision adds a bit of bulk with three thicknesses of leather plus the clip, making it a bit wider.  The Tailgunner is in the middle.

 

For "tucked" carry (shirt tucked in behind the clips but over the pistol and remainder of the holster), the Tailgunner must be eliminated as its not capable of this method.  Here's where the Split Decision really shines.  The single flat black clip is easier to hide and doesn't draw the eye in the way two evenly spaced glossier black clips with a cross embossed on them do.  I had my own observations, but to double check I have lent holsters out to a friend with his family unaware.  His family immediately "made" him with the Crossbreed.  The next week he wore the Split Decision when they went to church and his wife asked him why he wasn't carrying that Sunday.  When told he said he was carrying a gun and to find it, she checked his ankle before a pat down discovered it on his hip, with a black belt and the clip next to a belt loop the Split Decision was never noticed.

 

Crossbreed does offer alternate clips which would likely change this, but I haven't had the opportunity to test them so that's speculation on my part.  Crossbreed says that this trades stability for concealment, and the stability is really the main selling point of the Crossbreed over other offerings, IMO.

 

Concealability (untucked)

1st place: Super Tuck

2nd place: Split Decision

3rd place: Tailgunner

 

Concealibility (tucked)

1st place: Split Decision

2nd place: Super Tuck

Scratched: Tailgunner.

 

 

Cost:

 

1st place: Split Decision @ $40-ish

2nd place: Super Tuck @ $70-ish

3rd place: Tailgunner @ $110-ish

 

 

Conclusions

 

All 3 are viable choices, and which one "wins" really boils down to how you plan to carry.

 

The Super Tuck is a good value at the price.  If you plan to carry with an untucked shirt and are willing to fiddle with cutting and adjusting, it may be the best choice for you.

 

The Split Decision is the least expensive and you get a lot of quality for the money.  I'd say its an excellent value.  If you plan to carry tucked, with an undershirt behind the gun and a dress shirt or tucked in t-shirt over it, it may be the best choice for you.  However it is also the most sensitive to belt selection, so figure in the price of a good belt (such as the Daltech offerings) if you go this route.

 

The Tailgunner is the most expensive, and is custom boned for your gun.  Its a reasonable value but not a bargain.  If you plan to always carry untucked and don't want to fiddle with adjustments and cutting, or you don't like kydex and want all leather, this might be the best choice for you.

 

For me, if I had it to do over again, I'd order another Split Decision.  Its shortcomings are easily corrected with a quality belt, it ships faster, its cheaper, and the categories where the Super Tuck beat it the margins were slim.  In the category of concealabliity (tucked) the Split Decision blew the Super Tuck out of the water, even with the handicap of a double stack pistol vs a single stack.

---

Need a home defense gun or under $200?

 

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/1089/products_id/78648/VIP+FAST+TRACK/Stevens%20320SEC%2012GA%2018.5%20CYL%20PG/

 

Better than Biden's double barrel balcony gun, and cheaper.  12g is *the* golden standard for short range man stopping.

[JsinOwl 644]

I took the family out shooting today.  My wife and I both shot the Shield, and she fell in love with it.

 

For comparison, at 7 yards I took my time and shot 5 rounds through the Shield and my Taurus 650 back to back.  The clean holes are the .40 from the Shield, the ragged holes are .38 from the 650.

 

 

Keep in mind I've been shooting the 650 for about 6 years.  I'm about as good with it as I'm ever going to be.  This was the second string of 5 I've ever shot through the Shield.  I still shot the Shield slightly better.  I could probably tighten the Shield group up a bit if I spent some time with it learning the trigger.  It does stack a bit, and that threw me off some.

 

My wife, on the other hand, shot the Shield WAY better.  It wasn't even close.  The Taurus's trigger was simply too heavy for her to manage well, the whole revolver would start shaking from her straining before she could pull it back enough to fire.  Its probably a 13 lb trigger, so that's understandable.  No .38 snub is a beginner's gun, but the heavy trigger and lightweight makes an ultralight even more challenging.

 

This is my wife's second string of 5 (well, 4, she hasn't shot the 5th one yet).  The 5th shot went into the 10 ring, so 1 in the 10, 1 in the 9, 3 in the 8.  7 yards.

 

 

She's very happy with the Shield and its going to be her carry gun.

 

I shot it well, but I'm still not 100% on board with the trigger.  I don't think I like it enough to pick up a 2nd one for me.  If I was fresh on the market, I'd be more inclined to get one, but I don't shoot it that much better than the Taurus to justify the expense.  I'm trying to find a .357 LCR to see how I shoot it and if its enough of a difference to purchase.

[JsinOwl 644]

So does your wife carry because of all the issues with her family? Or she's so hot she fears for her safety?

[Docwagon 856]

So does your wife carry because of all the issues with her family? Or she's so hot she fears for her safety?

 

Her family isn't in the US, except for one 'friendly' brother in CA, so that's not much of a concern these days.  She carries mostly to humor me, I think.  She understands the benefits, but I think deep down inside she's a believer in "it will never happen to me."

[Docwagon 856]

Another quickie tip on ammunition.

 

Handgun ammunition in certain calibers will be available in different pressure levels.  Standard, +P, and +P+.  Standard and +P are defined by SAAMI and conform to certain specifications, +P+ is not defined.

 

Any firearm in good working order can handle standard pressure ammunition in its caliber.  Antique guns, brass framed revolvers, etc.

 

Most modern steel framed weapons can handle +P ammo, although you should check your owner's manual first.  The higher pressure will typically result in higher velocities, and is often used in short barreled weapons to overcome the velocity handicap of incomplete powder burn in short barrels.

 

Few manufacturers recommend the use of +P+.  In an antique firearm it could cause a catastrophic failure (ie, it blows up in your hand).  In a modern weapon rated for +P its unlikely a few rounds will cause a catastrophic failure, but you are likely accelerating wear and damaging your firearm minutely with each firing.

 

In a typical carry firearm, stick with standard pressure ammo.  In a short barreled weapon, particularly the .38 revolver, evaluate +P as it can be a significant advantage.  I say "evaluate" because their is no free ride, higher velocity = higher recoil (all else being equal), so you need to make sure the weapon is still controllable, doesn't induce flinch, and allows for reasonably quick follow up shots.

[BO7H B4RRELS 2,452]

A while back I had two of the 30 round banana clips for my Rugar 10/22.  I ended up giving one to my brother.  I'd like to get 3-5 more.  I heard they were banned, but now they're legal again.  Not sure... ?   Do you know of any good websites where I could order some quality ones at a reasonable price (assuming they're legal now). 

 

Also... what are the Indiana laws for knives as far as carrying and concealing them?  Is there a blade length limit? 

 

Thanks.

[Dattebayo 446]

Also... what are the Indiana laws for knives as far as carrying and concealing them? Is there a blade length limit?

It's 2-inch non-serrated here in California.

Wtf are you supposed to fend off with that?! xD

[JsinOwl 644]

There are laws on blade length for knives? I've never heard of such a thing. :/

[Dattebayo 446]

There are laws on blade length for knives? I've never heard of such a thing. :/

I would imagine so, owls have talons.

[Docwagon 856]

A while back I had two of the 30 round banana clips for my Rugar 10/22.  I ended up giving one to my brother.  I'd like to get 3-5 more.  I heard they were banned, but now they're legal again.  Not sure... ?   Do you know of any good websites where I could order some quality ones at a reasonable price (assuming they're legal now). 

 

Also... what are the Indiana laws for knives as far as carrying and concealing them?  Is there a blade length limit? 

 

Thanks.

 

The ban part is sorta true, sorta not.  They were never illegal to possess, buy, sell, etc.  You just couldn't make or import new ones.  That stopped in 2004 with the sunset of the Clinton AWB, though.  30 rounders are perfectly legal in Indiana and by federal law, although some states have more restrictive laws.  I'd check www.midway.com and www.brownells.com.  They are usually pretty fair on pricing and shipping.

 

Indiana's only knife prohibition is against throwing stars.  Seriously.  Its a misdemeanor to have a throwing knife with blades set at multiple angels.  No restrictions on concealment or blade length.  Auto-openers (aka switch blades) were made legal July 1st of this year.

[BO7H B4RRELS 2,452]

Thanks for the links and info.  I appreciate it. 

[JsinOwl 644]

I did some shooting in the tac bay at the police range today.  My wife went along and shot her Shield, but she also shot some photos of me.

 

Sig, working around and over cover at 25 yards:

 

Sig, doing a tac reload on the move.  (tac reload = you shot the gun but its not empty, lull in the action, so you put a fresh mag in.)  I shot all the steels on the left, started my tac reload, and then engaged the steels on the right on the move.  Approx 7 yards.

 

 

7 yards, 2 shots on each steel, then reload with the Ruger .357.  Note the smoke, this is from the waxy lubricant on the lead bullets.

 

 

After the reload, 2 more shots on each steel

 

[JsinOwl 644]

My Ruger collection continues to grow. I've now got the 2" LCR, 3" GP100, and today I got a deal I couldn't pass up on a 4" Security Six.

It's used but in great shape. No original grips, but some nice Pachmayr presentation grips.

I can't wait for Santa to bring me a chronograph for Christmas this year so I can play around and see how much barrel length affects different .357 loads.

[JsinOwl 644]

Nice man! Is Ruger a collectable brand? How does that work? What made you choose Ruger?

Collectible as in valuable, not really. They don't make many special runs, there are large production numbers of any given model, and few are out of production. They go up with general firearms prices, but they don't appreciate like true collectibles. There are three main "premium" brands of revolvers.

Colt is really your most collectible revolver brand. They are out of production (all of them, Colt no longer produces any revolver), are of good quality, and are often gorgeous. There are also some pretty famous Colts like the Python, Anaconda, Detective's Special, etc. The downside to Colt is parts availability. If you plan to shoot it a lot and break a spring or something, its expensive to find the part and repair it.

Pre-lock Smith and Wessons are somewhat collectible. (During the Clinton years, S&W started putting an integrated key hole into the side of their revolvers as a gun lock). Guns like the Model 29 (Dirty Harry's gun), Model 19 (Combat Magnum), etc. have a following but are still pretty affordable and easy to get parts for and repair as their newer key-holed counterparts are still in production.

Ruger is the workhouse brand. They are stronger than S&W or Colt. If you reload ammunition there are your standard recipes, then "Ruger/Dan Wesson only" loads which are only for use in those two brands as they'll damage lighter guns. Then you get "for Ruger Blackhawk/Redhawk only" which is every higher pressure. I also like the weight and durability of Rugers, plus if you ever have a problem you just call Ruger and they take care of it with no fuss.

Non-premium includes Taurus, Rossi, etc. They are low cost, function fine, but don't have the fit and finish, tolerances, and trigger feel of the premiums.

There are also low volume brands that may be great but for whatever reason never took off. Dan Wesson comes to mind. They are great revolvers and a great system for changing barrel lengths on a gun, but the cylinder release is very odd and difficult to use under stress, to they are relegated to target/range guns and being an also-ran.

I chose Ruger because I like the cylinder latch release. You push in to release like the semi-automatic pistol magazine release. I find this faster and easier to manipulate than the "push forward" release of Smith and Wesson and the "pull back" of the Colts. I also shoot my guns quite a bit, and could wear a Colt out.

The different barrel lengths are sort of like different golf clubs. 2" is great for pocket or ankle carry, making it a great backup gun or deep concealment gun. 3" heavy frame is very easy to carry inside the waistband and regular concealment or open carry. 4" medium frame is great for duty carry or outside the waist band carry. They all operate the same and have similar trigger feels, the same grip angle, etc. It keeps it simple instead of switching back and forth between different systems.

---

Here's the Ruger family photo:

All three are chambered in .357 Magnum.

The 2" is an LCR (Light Carry Revolver) and is current production.

The 3" is a GP100 Wiley Clapp edition. The WC may be a collectible one day, as it was a TALO exclusive and only 2,000 of each finish were made.

The 4" is a Security Six. The "Six" series is out of production, but there were so many made its unlikely to be a true collectible anytime soon. The "Six" series included the Speed six and the Service Six. The "Security" is the top end with adjustable sights. The Service six had fixed sights. The Speed six also had fixed sights, but was a round butt (instead of the square butt of the other two).

I'd like to add a 5" Redhawk in .44 magnum next, but am having trouble finding one at a price I want to pay. The 5" is somewhat rare.

[JsinOwl 644]

I shot my new Security Six today. (Well, it was new in 1979, new to me.)

First group:

Looks ok, right? Well, the group is fine but it was centered almost a foot above my point of aim. Luckily, adjusting the rear sights is very easy and with a few twists of a screwdriver I was able to adjust. I overshot the runway a bit with 7 clicks, backed off 2 clicks, and it was fine.

The chalk box is about the size of a credit card:

Shooting it back to back with my GP100 from 15 yards shooting as quick as I could find the front sight again (Security Six is on the left, GP100 on the right)

No significant difference in accuracy, but I did shoot the GP100 faster. This is likely because of the brass dot front site vs the all black sights on the Security Six.

Oddly enough, I felt like the 4" Security Six had more felt recoil. I suppose maybe its lighter than the heavier built GP100 despite the barrel length difference. It could also be a function of the grips. The Security Six's trigger feels smoother and is probably 1.5 lbs-2.5 lbs lighter.

Speed loaders are NOT interchangeable. The cylinder on the Security Six is slightly narrower. Its a small enough difference that holsters for one seem to work well enough with the other, though.

[JsinOwl 644]

I replaced the factory sights on my Sig P220 with Trijicon HD sights. The Trijicons look like this:

As you can see, there is no bright dot in the rear, only a deep "U" notch. The dull dots do glow at night to function as night sights.

The front sight is a large orange dot in the day and a regular green night sight at night.

I instantly loved these sights. So much so that I'm shelving the revolver and going back to carrying my P220 daily. At first I was shooting a bit low as I was holding the top of the front sight where I wanted to hit, but these are designed for the orange dot to cover the point of impact. Once I figured that out, these were the results:

Friday I'm going to the outdoor range so I can practice some rapid fire and target transitions, but I'm sure I'll shoot faster/better with this set up. The orange really pops and is easy to find, plus its easy to focus on the target and not lose the front sight.

[JsinOwl 644]

Thus concludes the transfer of old posts.

[Dattebayo 446]

The back of someone's head has never looked so manly.

[Docwagon 856]

Thus concludes the transfer of old posts.

 

Thanks, Jsin, I really appreciate the effort you spent getting all that transferred over.

[Docwagon 856]

The back of someone's head has never looked so manly.

[Docwagon 856]

A while back I had two of the 30 round banana clips for my Rugar 10/22. 

 

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Home/4th-Of-July-Shooting-Gear%7C/pc/105625080/c/107969580/Ruger174-BX-258482-Magazine/1229746.uts?avad=48247_f502b86f&WT.mc_id=al35987&rid=12&WT.tsrc=AFF

 

$21.99 for Ruger BX-25 mags for the 10-22.  I'm probaby going to pick up two myself.